From yaron@MIT.EDU Fri Feb 21 13:08:05 1997 Received: from PACIFIC-CARRIER-ANNEX.MIT.EDU by po10.MIT.EDU (5.61/4.7) id AA19582; Thu, 20 Feb 97 23:48:22 EST Received: from PO9.MIT.EDU by MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA20842; Thu, 20 Feb 97 23:48:19 EST Received: from BLUE-TRAIN.MIT.EDU by po9.MIT.EDU (5.61/4.7) id AA07482; Thu, 20 Feb 97 23:48:16 EST Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970221054646.00be7598@po9.mit.edu> X-Sender: yaron@po9.mit.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 23:46:46 -0600 To: mitsi-talk@MIT.EDU, frisch1@MIT.EDU From: Yaron Koren Subject: Transforming MITSI Lines: 24 Xref: small-gods misc:8 Unfortunately, as far as the purpose and constitution of MITSI currently stand, it is not a true ethnic/national organization as MIT defines one, and so isn't allowed represent Israel at the international fair (this is according to Miriam Rosenblum). I can't imagine hijacking MITSI and totally transforming it (making it "of Israelis" instead of "for Israel") just to get past this regulation. Even if it is a mostly defunct group, it still has a definite, important purpose, and there's no reason why it shouldn't start being active again like it was at the beginning of last year. Let me just take this time to apologize for calling MITSI a right-wing group... as I have been informed repeatedly, :) this is just the fault of whoever made the web page. Judging by people's responses I would guess that this person was the page's only reader as well as its only writer... So, here's my new idea: create the Israeli Students Club, and have its sole purpose be to man the Israel booth every year - a three-hour event. Any other Israel-related event, whether social or political, would be in the hands of MITSI. How does that sound? (I'm not on 'mitsi-talk', so please send any responses to me as well...) - Yaron From sherer@actcom.co.il Fri Feb 21 13:08:22 1997 Received: from SOUTH-STATION-ANNEX.MIT.EDU by po10.MIT.EDU (5.61/4.7) id AA09059; Fri, 21 Feb 97 05:01:33 EST Received: from david.jer1.co.il by MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA22379; Fri, 21 Feb 97 05:01:28 EST Received: from host (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by david.jer1.co.il (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA14621; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 08:57:34 GMT Received: from actcom.co.il (root@actcom.co.il [192.114.47.1]) by david.jer1.co.il (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA12911 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 08:07:17 GMT Received: from sherer.actcom.co.il by actcom.co.il with SMTP (8.8.4/actcom-0.1) id LAA04067 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 11:10:12 +0200 (EET) (rfc931-sender: p15.j1.actcom.co.il [192.114.234.45]) Message-Id: <199702210910.LAA04067@actcom.co.il> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 11:04:34 +0200 Reply-To: tachlis@jer1.co.il Sender: owner-tachlis@jer1.co.il Precedence: bulk From: "Carl and Adina Sherer" To: "Practical Q&A about Alia" Subject: (Fwd) MED: MIDWEEK EXTRA - No 007 - LIVING ON CREDIT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.42a) X-Listprocessor-Version: 7.2 -- ListProcessor by CREN Lines: 229 Xref: small-gods misc:21 I don't know how many of you get Mideast Dispatch so I figured I would post this. While it's outlook is a overly glum even for my tastes, I think it does a good job of explaining why people are in overdrafts, how much certain basic items cost here and things like that - sort of a primer for those who have no idea how the Israeli economy works. Shabbat Shalom. -- Carl ------- Forwarded Message Follows ------- Date: Thu, 20 Feb 1997 14:41:21 -0500 From: newsdesk@iipub.com (MED News Desk) To: med@iipub.com (Mid-East Dispatch) Subject: MED: MIDWEEK EXTRA - No 007 - LIVING ON CREDIT Reply-to: newsdesk@iipub.com THE MID-EAST DISPATCH WEEKEND EXTRA - No. 007 - 20th February 1997 The great majority of Israelis are in debt to their bank. High inflation, antiquated working practices and restrictive mortgages conspire to put the average Israeli family in the red right from the start. Betsy Broschowitz describes the dilemma. LIVING ON CREDIT It was recently reported that seventy percent of the Israeli population lives on overdraft from the bank. Total monies owed to the banks in Israel is about NIS 60 billion. The usual maximum overdraft granted by a bank is equal to the monthly salary deposited into the bank. Today, overdraft interest rates run at about 19% per annum. That's the basic background to a steadily growing crisis which is attacking the roots of family life in Israel. On the face of it, it isn't a terrible situation - 19% interest rates on a month's salary compares reasonably with other Western countries, or with major credit card companies. But there are peculiarities to the Israeli structure which create problems. For example on an overdraft of NIS 10,000, the yearly interest rate is NIS 1,900. Someone who goes over his "allotted" overdraft pays an additional 'fine' of 1.5%, and banks report that this is fairly common. Besides interest payments, there are other fees collected by the bank such as a per transaction charge (at the bank counter and at the automatic teller), a fee for generating the paperwork, and a monthly fee for the bank to transfer the payment back into their account. The banks never lose, whether the money's coming in, or going out. But the really crushing situation for Israelis is the cost of their mortgages. In Israel, it is possible to owe the bank more on your 30 year mortgage several years after taking it out than at the beginning. This is due to linkage. What is linkage? The linkage is to inflation. When a loan is taken out, in each payment, one pays back a small part of the principal, interest and linkage. As inflation grows, so does the amount of money one owes. So in real terms one owes more after several years of payment due to inflation...sort of two steps forward, one step back. There is no locking yourself into a good rate, as in the USA where 30-year mortgages on a fixed interest rate are common. The banks would never allow that. So it's no wonder Israelis need an overdraft to live. A car, while no great luxury, costs, at a minimum about NIS 65,000 (for a South Korean Daewoo) or close to $20,000. Depending on the size of the engine, taxes add between 200-300% to the price of a car. A car costing $9,000 in the US (Hyundai) costs $35,000 in Israel. A $25,000 car (Plymouth Voyager) in the US costs $60,000 in Israel. It is not only cars which are expensive. A 20 cu. liter refrigerator (Israeli made) costs about NIS 5,000. A 21=89 television (Japanese) costs about NIS 3,500, and a very small washing machine (German) costs about NIS 3,000. Gasoline costs about $3.80 per gallon and the same baby stroller that costs $100 in New York costs $250 in Israel. So how does an Israeli make it? Well, as stated above, with an overdraft. Overdraft and various versions of it. Michal is 25 years old. She is a clerk and nets about NIS 2100. Her husband is a cop, his salary is about NIS 3,000 net. They carry their overdraft from month to month. They've tried to get rid of the overdraft with a formal loan (smaller interest payments) but they find themselves back with the overdraft. Their salaries just don't cover living. They took out a mortgage, but Michal asks "How can a young couple not be in the red when they owe at least NIS 3,000 per month on mortgage repayments?" She adds "We do not buy clothing - and entertainment is not in our budget." Michal has no choice but to work. Fortunately, she still has no children. Since the average (mean) monthly salary in Israel is NIS 5,000, Michal's story is typical of families trying to stretch salaries to match exorbitant Israeli prices and make the 'linkage' based mortgage repayments. Overdrafts of NIS 20,000, 30,000, and even 50,000 are not very unusual. This is often based on the relationship between the bank manager and the customer. Sara 31, has 2 children aged 7 and 2. She must work as her husband nets NIS 4,500. Fortunately, Sara works in the private sector as an executive secretary and nets about NIS 5,500. They carry a mortgage of NIS 3,200 monthly repayments, and child care costs upward of NIS 2,000 per month. Generally, mothers in Israel go out to work. More often than not their salaries are entirely taken up with paying for child care while the mother is working. They work not for the money today, but to guarantee their seniority in a future slot in the workplace as in Israel, seniority dictates salary. Seniority means longevity. A teacher working 10 years gets a higher salary than one who has worked 8 years. In some professions, where one wishes to reward long-term loyalty, this makes some sense. Unfortunately, it also carries over into other professions, and this discourages excellence, risk-taking, and even effort itself. It also creates a less mobile workforce. So working mothers will take a job now which, after child-care costs, pays little or nothing into the family budget, in the expectation of getting a better reward years later, as their seniority inexorably increases. The number of single-parent families is also on the increase. Debt-related pressure can take its toll on a marriage, but many new immigrants are also single-parent families. 13% of immigrants arriving in Israel from the CIS, the former Soviet Union, in 1996, were single-parent families, and the overwhelming majority were single women. Cars and washing-machines one might do without - and many do - but nobody can avoid the housing trap. Renting is not a feasible long-term option as rents are a minimum of $500 per month, linked to the dollar. Today that is over NIS 1,500. Plus the renter must pay property taxes and maintenance costs on the apartment. One does not get away cheap=82 here in Israel. Homelessness, once non-existent in Israel is a growing problem. People who feel they cannot afford housing, whether it be rent or mortgage will squat=82 under whatever shelter they can find. Whether it is a tent in front of the Knesset, or a trash room in an apartment building, these people are still homeless. For those with mortgages, there is a certain security, in that banks will not grant a loan using the home as the collateral for the loan which pays for it. This means the bank cannot repossess your home. Instead, home loans are secured with guarantors. A bank requires 3-5 people to guarantee the loan before it will grant it. When a person defaults, the bank goes after the signatories. Of course, the signatories are all likely to be struggling with the payments on a mortgage of their own. Thus one family's problem becomes the problem of three or four families, dragging even those who were keeping their head above water and paying their debts into the deepening debt spiral. In the past, the banks used to hunt guarantors down one at a time. Nowadays, they tend to go after all the guarantors simultaneously. Research shows that the price of an average apartment has risen to 100 monthly gross salaries of the average worker. In the past (1977 for example, twenty years ago) the price of an apartment was 45 monthly gross salaries. By way of comparison, according to 1993 statistics it took 30-36 monthly gross salaries to buy a home in the United States. So the real terms cost of an average apartment in Israel as measured against earnings, is twice what it was twenty years ago, and three times what it is in the USA. T While for the average worker things are difficult, there are a few ray of sunshine in all this gloom. One is savings plans in which one puts small amounts of money into the bank which is inflation-linked and earns interest. These are for fixed terms of a minimum of two years, and at the conclusion can reap significant sums of money. The small sums would not really be a contributing factor to an excessive overdraft, except in extreme cases. Another option is a fund in which the employer and employee pay towards it monthly for a total of 10% of a monthly gross salary (50-50 or 75-25). At the end of six years, a substantial sum can be accumulated which goes a long way toward helping a family financially as long as you plan early enough, and can afford the 10% payments. But as Dov, 32 and the father of 5 children said "I'm waiting for salvation from heaven. Whoever prays to G-d is answered. With G-d's help I'll get out of the red." **** Copyright (c) The MidEast Dispatch, 1997. The MidEast Dispatch is an independent news service, and is not affiliated with any political party or government agency. To subscribe to MED, please e-mail med-request@iipub.com with the single word 'subscribe' in the body of the message. To unsubscribe, send email to med-request@iipub.com with the single word 'unsubscribe' in the body of the message. If you have any questions, please write to: newsdesk@iipub.com 27 Heathway Court London NW3 7TS United Kingdom Tel: 44-181-458-6510, Fax: 44-181-455-8701 Thank you for davening for our son, Baruch Yosef ben Adina Batya. Please keep him in mind for a healthy, long life. Carl and Adina Sherer mailto:sherer@actcom.co.il From ejnaiman@netvision.net.il Fri Feb 21 13:08:29 1997 Received: from PACIFIC-CARRIER-ANNEX.MIT.EDU by po10.MIT.EDU (5.61/4.7) id AA18349; Fri, 21 Feb 97 08:22:36 EST Received: from david.jer1.co.il by MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA13418; Fri, 21 Feb 97 08:22:33 EST Received: from host (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by david.jer1.co.il (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA25673; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 12:17:23 GMT Received: from nvsgi1.netvision.net.il (nvsgi1.NetVision.net.il [194.90.1.31]) by david.jer1.co.il (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA19596 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 11:03:02 GMT Received: from ejnaiman (ts015p16.pop2a.netvision.net.il [199.203.101.36]) by nvsgi1.netvision.net.il (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA20219 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 14:03:56 +0200 (IST) Message-Id: <199702211203.OAA20219@nvsgi1.netvision.net.il> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 14:02:36 +0000 Reply-To: tachlis@jer1.co.il Sender: owner-tachlis@jer1.co.il Precedence: bulk From: "Ephrayim "EJ" Naiman" To: "Practical Q&A about Alia" Subject: Re: TAX-FREE COMPUTERS? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) X-Listprocessor-Version: 7.2 -- ListProcessor by CREN Lines: 12 Xref: small-gods misc:30 > If you are not making aliyah, at the time you bring the computer in, you will > be assesed 17 % VAT and 2% meches on the value of the computer. It's up to you > to prove the meches people wrong, bring recepts, computer shopper magazine, etc. This is not correct. As a tourist, you can get away with NOT paying 17% + 2%. Instead you can have a credit card form filled out that guarantees the money until you leave the country. As an Oleh you MUST pay the 17% + 2%. Ephrayim "EJ" Naiman ejnaiman@netvision.net.il From warlord@MIT.EDU Fri Feb 21 13:08:33 1997 Received: from SOUTH-STATION-ANNEX.MIT.EDU by po10.MIT.EDU (5.61/4.7) id AA12835; Fri, 21 Feb 97 12:34:24 EST Received: from CUTTER-JOHN.MIT.EDU by MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA15562; Fri, 21 Feb 97 12:34:22 EST Received: (from warlord@localhost) by cutter-john.mit.edu (8.8.5/8.7.3) id MAA31407; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 12:34:20 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 12:34:20 -0500 Message-Id: <199702211734.MAA31407@cutter-john.mit.edu> From: Derek Atkins To: usenet@MIT.EDU Subject: access to news.mit.edu Lines: 6 Xref: small-gods misc:45 Since we're adding home machines to the acl for news.mit.edu, can you add my home network? 207.107.200.0? Thanks! -derek